Ambition

Sun Jul 23 19:39:19 CDT 2006

Dear Grace, I can say with great certainty that there is no conserve against competitiveness. There may be a range of socio-economic-political orientations that might be slightly or moderately skewed to left-of-center in some communities and regions, but this doesn't constitute a conserve--in the sense of any written doctrine that I'm aware of. 
       You do bring out a point, though, which is that folks tend to interpret scripture or theory or whatever in such a way as to support their socio-economic political orientation, and that it takes a high degree of devotion to precision, a bit of skepticism, to refuse to appeal to authority--i.e., citing the conserve as being supportive of one's bias.

         I'd be interested to see if anyone disagrees with what I've said about the above. 

        What seems incompatible with psychodrama theory is any reliance on the past, the conserve, what Moreno said because he said it, or any other seeming authority. The spirit of spontaneity in my opinion invites a re-evaluation of the present and how past ideas may fit, not fit, or need minor or major revisions to be useful. 

      Warmly, Adam
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Grace 
  To: list at grouptalkweb.org 
  Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 6:53 PM
  Subject: RE: Ambition

  Kia ora Adam and others

  Hamish's thoughts answer for me to some degree your question:  "a somewhat conserved response to what 'forms' of ambition are 'acceptable' and what do not 'go' with their notion of the 'spirit of psychodrama'." Can you say more about this? It might be important for us to clarify what may seem incompatible with psychodrama's spirit, and what might be wrong understanding".

  Just as Hamish observes in the western/commercial world a bias towards individual (competitiveness) at the expense of the group, I believe there is somewhat of a conserve in the psychodrama world towards 'community' that is often at the expense of the individual.   It is a bias that I believe stems from the majority working in community and therapeutic settings, who would see that 'making money' from the use of the method as slightly (or more so) distasteful, and exclusive of those who cannot afford it.   

  I reckon the 'spirit of psychodrama' is much bigger, inclusive and working towards the balancing of both of these aspects of human endeavour.  I like your suggestion Hamish, of looking below the surface to the intention or essence of the endeavour, and I believe that at the heart of both the above world views is a similar desire to make the world a better place.

  cheers

  Grace

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  From: list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org [mailto:list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org] On Behalf Of Johanna and Hamish
  Sent: Sunday, 23 July 2006 9:21 a.m.
  To: list at grouptalkweb.org
  Subject: RE: Ambition

  Hullo Grace and Peter and others

  I am responding a lot to this thread about ambition.  Grace I like you talking about 'being inclusive of all that exists as human endeavor'.

  Like you I think that Ambition is a facet of spontaneity.  I think it is a natural human thing to want to become who we can become to dream and make our dreams real through our actions and creations.  

  There is a cultural conserve in the western world which encourages competitiveness - becoming better than others.  In my view this conserve often kind of perverts or displaces the natural desire to be who we can be, into aggressiveness and domination of others.  As I work in organisations I often find myself thinking that people leaving university, getting a job and desiring to contribute are faced with a system that encourages ladder climbing and 'being better than'.  People struggling to experience self worth are offered meaning in terms of getting higher faster.  Sometimes I have found that underneath the ruthless corporate climbing exterior is a person wanting a kind of self expression which brings satisfaction, contribution, using ones talents to make the world a better place. 

  I think I am privileged in that I generally get to work with people who have been successful in this corporate sense and then found that their success is empty and unsatisfying.  So they are already looking for a means to use their skills and talents for things which feel good to them.  Very often these things seem to involve contribution to others rather than competition with others.  To me it is a very natural thing to want to make the world a better place.

  Cheers Hamish

  Hamish Brown

  Director

  Zenergy

  Whole People Co-operating in a Sustainable world

  119 Mt Eden Rd,

  Auckland

  www.zenergyglobal.com 

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  From: list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org [mailto:list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org] On Behalf Of Grace
  Sent: Friday, 21 mmmm 2006 2:50
  To: list at grouptalkweb.org
  Subject: RE: Ambition

  Kia ora Peter,

  I too have thought long and hard on ambition.  Here are some thought from me:

  When I worked fully in the community and education sectors I always considered I had little ambition, and I took this as a given about myself.  Having taken the plunge into creating a lifestyle for myself that centres on promoting psychodrama and Morenian processes in ALL I do, I find that my ambition to make it work is what gets me up and going in the morning!  It is also what sustains me when my flaws and foibles get away on me and I don't manage to create what I am seeking (i.e. I fail).  It also assists greatly assisting me to identify the criteria for making choices, whether it be who I associate with, how I construct my support networks, what work I do etc.  Yay for ambition I say!

  I have found that the tendency for psychodrama to be practiced mainly as a therapeutic and community-based method here in Aotearoa New Zealand (and probably Australia) has had a significant influence on a range of factors influencing in promotion of the method.  This includes, I would suggest with a little trepidation, a somewhat conserved response to what 'forms' of ambition are 'acceptable' and what do not 'go' with their notion of the 'spirit of psychodrama'.   I have observed people from other sectors come into the community and initially become very excited about the potential application of the method for their own work.  However it seems they tend to go again after a relatively short period of time satisfied that they have gained personally but discouraged and sometimes disillusioned that there is any application in a wider context.  

  From my own experience my observation is that ambition is an expression of spontaneity, not sparked by comfort (a little like spontaneity), nor nurtured by isolation (ditto).  I have watched my ambition grow as I get closer to being able to live spontaneously in all aspects of my life.  My understanding of Moreno's method and his notion of sociatry, is that it is 'inclusive' of all that exists as human endeavour, and when I read his work, such as Who shall Survive? and the Words of the Father, I feel encouraged that Moreno saw his method applied widely for the benefit of humankind whatever the context.  I find this very exciting!

  I'm not sure if this is the sort of thing you were asking about, but here you go anyway.

  Cheers

  Grace 

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  From: list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org [mailto:list-bounces at grouptalkweb.org] On Behalf Of Peter Howie
  Sent: Friday, 21 July 2006 11:47 a.m.
  To: list at grouptalkweb.org
  Subject: Ambition

  Hi all,

  I've been thinking recently about what keeps me going at times, what keeps others going and thing of this nature. Watching Frank Lowy in a documentary, a multi-billionaire Aussie with 180 mega-shopping complexes around the world, who funded the turn-around of Australian soccer/football and helped get us to international status, when asked what kept him going he said he was still full of ambition.

  I'm imagining that J L Moreno was also full of ambition, ambition to do many things, one of which was to promote and teach his remarkable method and to try and set up systems to support its ongoing practice, teaching, methodological review and improvement and philosophical development. 

  I'm thinking on this and wondering about my own level of ambition. Psychodramatists with ambition that I know of would be Kate with the Spiral model work, Marcia Karp, Max Clayton - and there would be heaps of others. I am not thinking about abilities or skills as a trainer, educator or practitioner. More about their ambition to relentlessly push forward in creating a world that they would like to live in, surrounded by colleagues who support and challenge them and keeping going despite their own human flaws and foibles.

  Anyway - this rises for me as I contemplate doing things a bit differently around here with how I spend my time promoting psychodrama and Morenian processes. How much do I have. Ho much do those around me support or parallel me. Things like this.

  So how does this idea of ambition sit with some of you?

  Cheers for now

  Peter Howie
  Brisbane, Australia

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